{"id":3852,"date":"2012-02-23T15:53:53","date_gmt":"2012-02-23T22:53:53","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=3852"},"modified":"2012-02-28T15:31:40","modified_gmt":"2012-02-28T22:31:40","slug":"why-the-pantheacon-gender-controversy-persists","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=3852","title":{"rendered":"Why the Pantheacon Gender Controversy Persists"},"content":{"rendered":"

For the second year running, some attendees at Pantheacon have become involved in protests, sit-ins, and a whole lot of blog posts about gender issues<\/a>.<\/p>\n

I am not going to weigh in on Z Budapest, etc. I was not there. But I was reading a post on Religion Bulletin <\/em>the other day titled “Yogis and the Politics of Offense,<\/a>”\u00a0 by Matt Sheedy, that suggested a reason for the size and persistence of this particular Pantheacon kerfuffle.<\/p>\n

Reading past the yogis and the “Shit Yogis Say” parody video<\/a>, I came to this paragraph:<\/p>\n

When groups are new and not well defined, and where the boundaries of their self-understanding are generally recognized to be unstable, the work of critique becomes that much easier since it focuses the conversation on tangible matters that can be discussed and debated. As many scholars are aware, this instability and contingency is true of all religious formations, yet it remains an uphill battle to speak of older traditions in the same way\u2014unless of course one\u2019s goal is to cause offense in the first place.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Contemporary Paganism in all its forms is “not well defined.” Our boundaries are not merely porous, they are vaporous. You could do a “Shit Pagans Say” video \u2014 and maybe someone has \u2014 but a lot of Pagans probably would say that it just critiques the fluff bunnies or something, that none of “that stuff” is really central to their spiritual practice.<\/p>\n

On the other hand, the author writes,<\/p>\n

Whenever the social practices of a group are presented as the essence of that group as<\/em> a social whole<\/em>, there is a risk of causing offense. For something to be considered \u201coffensive\u201d in a categorical sense, however, it must involve more than hurt feelings on the part of an individual. There must be some notion of a \u201csocial whole\u201d in the first place and, what is more, those things that are being lampooned must be considered central <\/em>to the self-understanding of the group in question.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Sheedy argues that another video, “Shit Girls Say,” is indeed offensive because it addresses a social whole<\/em>, whereas “Shit Yogis Say” does not.<\/p>\n

If “girls” constitute a social whole, then certainly “women” do as well.\u00a0 There is a general assumption of what constitutes “women.” Some people insist that self-identified transwomen, for example,\u00a0 can also be included. But there is<\/em><\/strong> a boundary, and the argument is about who is inside it and who is not. There is something worth struggling over \u2014 as long as Paganism(s) valorize women-only ritual and female religious leadership.<\/p>\n

UPDATE, Feb. 28:<\/strong> Gus diZerega writes the most reasonable blog post on this whole issue from a Pagan-politics standpoint that I have seen.<\/a><\/p>\n

To summarize, the protest against Z\u2019s genetic-women only ritual was political<\/em>.\u00a0 Its advocates were making a statement about how they believe the entire Pagan community should act: not simply not to condemn, not simply to accept other ways, but to modify their ways so as to include a group that wanted such affirmation even while they were free to practice in their own way within a largely accepting environment.\u00a0 Sometimes this is necessary to do, as with a hypothetical case of having the community ban a group practicing ritual child abuse. But most of the time this is not necessary.<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

I am asking different questions, but I applaud Gus for making that point. Wicca, in particular, has always been a small-l libertarian, “live and let live,” do-it-yourself religion. I hate to see one group demanding that another group change its ways to accommodate them<\/em> based on a self-proclaimed moral authority.<\/div>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

For the second year running, some attendees at Pantheacon have become involved in protests, sit-ins, and a whole lot of blog posts about gender issues. I am not going to weigh in on Z Budapest, etc. I was not there. But I was reading a post on Religion Bulletin the other day titled “Yogis and […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_jetpack_newsletter_access":"","_jetpack_dont_email_post_to_subs":false,"_jetpack_newsletter_tier_id":0,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paywalled_content":false,"_jetpack_memberships_contains_paid_content":false,"footnotes":"","jetpack_post_was_ever_published":false},"categories":[1],"tags":[10,75,5,6,141],"class_list":["post-3852","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-uncategorized","tag-american-religion","tag-california","tag-paganism","tag-wicca","tag-women"],"jetpack_featured_media_url":"","jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_shortlink":"https:\/\/wp.me\/p6xQTg-108","jetpack_likes_enabled":true,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":4170,"url":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=4170","url_meta":{"origin":3852,"position":0},"title":"Pagan Studies Conference Timed for Pantheacon","author":"Chas S. Clifton","date":"April 30, 2012","format":false,"excerpt":"Announcement of a new conference: Pagans in Dialogue with the Wider World: A Pagan Studies Symposium Friday, February 15, 2013 at San Jos\u00e9 State University (semi-concurrent with PantheaCon, February 15-18, 2013, DoubleTree Hotel, San Jose, California) Sponsored by San Jos\u00e9 State University, Humanities Dept., Comparative Religious Studies Program. Organizers: Lee\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"California\"","block_context":{"text":"California","link":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?tag=california"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":6371,"url":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=6371","url_meta":{"origin":3852,"position":1},"title":"This is how the [blank] see me","author":"Chas S. Clifton","date":"April 1, 2014","format":false,"excerpt":"In the middle of working out Contemporary Pagan Studies Group sessions and co-sponsored sessions for next November's American Academy of Religion annual meeting. So far this has taken hundred of emails\u2014so it goes\u2014and a phone call this morning from Norway. Landlines still have their place. It feels so good to\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"academia\"","block_context":{"text":"academia","link":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?tag=academia"},"img":{"alt_text":"I copied this from a friend's Facebook feed. I don't know where it started. This is the Internetz.","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/blog.chasclifton.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2014\/04\/religious-studies-cat.jpg?resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":8462,"url":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=8462","url_meta":{"origin":3852,"position":2},"title":"Survey: Pagan Spirituality in Resilience","author":"Chas S. Clifton","date":"February 7, 2017","format":false,"excerpt":"I am passing this survey information on from a colleague: My name is David Christy, I am currently a Ph.D. student in the Pastoral Counseling department at Loyola University Maryland. Several years ago I participated in a series of conversations at Pantheacon focused on the needs of the Pagan community.\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"American religion\"","block_context":{"text":"American religion","link":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?tag=american-religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":13148,"url":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=13148","url_meta":{"origin":3852,"position":3},"title":"Witch Dance is a Phenomenon","author":"Chas S. Clifton","date":"December 17, 2022","format":false,"excerpt":"\"Time was,\" Minnesota witch Steven Posch wrote in 2016, \"here in Paganistan, the Besom Brigade used to show up at the Heart of the Beast May Day Parade, black steeple hats and all, doing our precision broom drills down the middle of Bloomington Avenue.\" A sort of drill team with\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"dance\"","block_context":{"text":"dance","link":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?tag=dance"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/img.youtube.com\/vi\/orDHt1qosDg\/0.jpg?resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":4718,"url":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=4718","url_meta":{"origin":3852,"position":4},"title":"A Day and a Night in Occult Chicago","author":"Chas S. Clifton","date":"November 24, 2012","format":false,"excerpt":"For the third time in four years, we had a pre-conference event that tied into Pagan studies somehow. (Previously: Montr\u00e9al, San Francisco.) This was the Occult Chicago conference organized by Jason Winslade at DePaul University\u2014his take on \"Chicago Quarter,\" an urban orientation class that all first-year DePaul students must take.\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"Chicago\"","block_context":{"text":"Chicago","link":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?tag=chicago"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/blog.chasclifton.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2012\/11\/ceres1-300x294.jpg?resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":6232,"url":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?p=6232","url_meta":{"origin":3852,"position":5},"title":"Contemporary Pagan Studies Group’s Call for Papers","author":"Chas S. Clifton","date":"January 21, 2014","format":false,"excerpt":"The process to submit papers for the Contemporary Pagan Studies Group's sessions at next November's American Academy of Religion meeting is now open. The submission deadline is March 3, 2014. More information and links can be found here. Call for Papers We invite individual papers, papers, sessions, and roundtable proposals\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"American religion\"","block_context":{"text":"American religion","link":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/?tag=american-religion"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]}],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3852","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=3852"}],"version-history":[{"count":7,"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3852\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":3879,"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/3852\/revisions\/3879"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=3852"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=3852"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/blog.chasclifton.com\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=3852"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}